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    HISE FX and delay compensation

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    • Christoph HartC
      Christoph Hart
      last edited by

      The idea of this entire call is to report to the host how many samples it needs to compensate (= preroll). It‘s a basic feature in JUCE which I‘ve just wrote a simple wrapper for it. Apparently it doesn‘t work for the majority of hosts but there‘s nothing else I can do.

      Now I don‘t have the time currently to go through every host and check whether it works, but we can make a list here with hosts that support / don‘t support this feature, then I can take it to the JUCE team.

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
      • Christoph HartC
        Christoph Hart
        last edited by

        Also if anyone finds a useful information in the JUCE forum (just search for setLatencySamples), you‘ll get plenty of topics), I am happy to take that into account.

        Dan KorneffD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
        • Dan KorneffD
          Dan Korneff @Christoph Hart
          last edited by

          @Christoph-Hart I'll take a look on the forms this weekend.

          Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

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          • orangeO
            orange
            last edited by orange

            I found this threads, they may be helpful. Also I see that they prefer to use setLatencySamples() in prepareToPlay. But we're using it in onInit, could that be the cause?

            https://forum.juce.com/t/cubase-latency-issues/27669

            https://forum.juce.com/t/look-ahead-vs-daws-latency-compensation/30384/2

            https://forum.juce.com/t/vstplugininstance-getlatencysamples/7934

            https://forum.juce.com/t/setlatencysamples-int-newlatency-in-cubase-and-bitwig-in-vst3-win-and-mac/15061/3

            develop Branch / XCode 13.1
            macOS Monterey / M1 Max

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            • Christoph HartC
              Christoph Hart
              last edited by

              Well, onInit comes way before prepareToPlay, so if it's not set correctly by then, we're screwed anyway.

              However, I've encorporated a few things mentioned in the threads:

              • resend the latency update in prepareToPlay if it's different than at the last call
              • add a static delay line to the bypassed processing chain (I thought the host would do this, but it makes sense that it's the plugins job to delay it).

              While the first one is pretty cosmetic, I think the last one might be actually helpful.
              Unfortunately I am not in my studio right now, so I can't test the hosts, but I pushed it to the scriptnode branch so if anyone wants to check if this improves the situation, have a go.

              orangeO 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 2
              • orangeO
                orange @Christoph Hart
                last edited by

                @Christoph-Hart I've just tried, result is the same :/

                develop Branch / XCode 13.1
                macOS Monterey / M1 Max

                Dan KorneffD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • Dan KorneffD
                  Dan Korneff @orange
                  last edited by

                  @orange @Christoph-Hart I just tested latest version of ScriptNode. Cubase is picking up the reported latency.
                  Gotta test to see how accurate it is.

                  Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

                  FortuneF 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                  • FortuneF
                    Fortune @Dan Korneff
                    last edited by Fortune

                    @dustbro Yeah Cubase can detect the latency value, there is no problem about it. You can also see that in the Cubase plugin manager.

                    But the problem is, wet and dry channels are not in sync. Delay still persists.

                    Dan KorneffD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
                    • Dan KorneffD
                      Dan Korneff @Fortune
                      last edited by

                      @Fortune got it.

                      Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

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                      • Christoph HartC
                        Christoph Hart
                        last edited by

                        OK, I've committed a fix for a typo that caused crackling when a delayed plugin is bypassed.

                        I've also made a example project with a latency of 200ms - it's just a simple delay without anything else:

                        Link Preview Image
                        hise_tutorial/LatencyTest at master · christophhart/hise_tutorial

                        The Tutorial project for HISE. Contribute to christophhart/hise_tutorial development by creating an account on GitHub.

                        favicon

                        GitHub (github.com)

                        The sample amount will get calculated on the initialisation and the latency will be changed accordingly (so to eg. 8820 samples on 44,1 kHz).

                        I've tested these hosts:

                        • Cubase 9: Latency is reported correctly, both active and bypassed plugins are in sync
                        • REAPER 5: Latency is reported correctly, both active and bypassed plugins are in sync
                        • Ableton 9: Latency is reported correctly, both active and bypassed plugins are in sync

                        Please try your hosts and report back any problems:

                        1. Compile the LatencyTest plugin as FX plugin.
                        2. Load up your DAW and add two audio tracks with the same audio data
                        3. Load the LatencyTest VST plugin into one of them
                        4. Play and check that it's in sync. Bypass the plugin and play again, check that it's still in sync.
                        FortuneF 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 3
                        • Dan KorneffD
                          Dan Korneff
                          last edited by

                          💪

                          Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                          • FortuneF
                            Fortune @Christoph Hart
                            last edited by

                            First of all, you did it, well done @Christoph-Hart !

                            I am pretty impressed. Especially calculating the delay time acording to sample rate and ms conversion multiplying is a clever idea. Yeah it needs some improvements but you did most of the thing. As you can see, you can do it.

                            My check is that:

                            Windows:

                            • It works well on Cubase 10, Reaper 5, Ableton 10, Studio One 4.5, Pro Tools 2019 Ultimate!
                            • In FL Studio 12 & 20- it fails again. I hear 200 ms latency unfortunately :/

                            Mac

                            • Reaper, Ableton, Studio One, Pro Tools did it very good.
                            • In Logic Pro X, When you insert the plugin in the channel, it takes approximately 2 seconds to sync. You can hear fade of the phase shift before synching, after 2 seconds it is in sync. This fade time can be disturbing to some users. You can improve it.
                            • FL Studio 20 - fails again. I hear 200 ms latency unfortunately :/

                            Also I have some questions;

                            • To calculate the delay time , can we take the delay time of the plugin with "getlatency" and use it on "setLatency"?
                            • I tried that code in "if / else statement" but it doesn't work properly. I usedin different oversampling modes, delay time changes when OS is on and off. For setLatency, only first statement works. Can that be done?
                            1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • Christoph HartC
                              Christoph Hart
                              last edited by

                              You can improve it

                              How? I am not the Logic developer.

                              FortuneF 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • FortuneF
                                Fortune @Christoph Hart
                                last edited by

                                @Christoph-Hart said in HISE FX and delay compensation:

                                You can improve it

                                How? I am not the Logic developer.

                                You are right, it seems like it is a Logic issue.
                                https://forum.juce.com/t/logic-pro-x-midi-fx-plug-in-latency-compensation-timeshift/23855

                                What about FL Studio?

                                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • lalalandsynthL
                                  lalalandsynth
                                  last edited by

                                  What is the status of this issue ?
                                  Do I need to need to do anything manually to take care of latency or does Hise take care of that ?

                                  https://lalalandaudio.com/

                                  https://lalalandsynth.com/

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                                  lalalandsynthL 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • lalalandsynthL
                                    lalalandsynth @lalalandsynth
                                    last edited by

                                    @lalalandsynth nudge topic.

                                    https://lalalandaudio.com/

                                    https://lalalandsynth.com/

                                    https://www.facebook.com/lalalandsynth

                                    https://www.facebook.com/lalalandsynth

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                                    • Dan KorneffD
                                      Dan Korneff @Fortune
                                      last edited by

                                      @Fortune said in HISE FX and delay compensation:

                                      With this way, plugin reports delay compensation to the DAW in the very begining of the initialization.

                                      Is there a way to adjust delay compensation after a plugin has been initialized? The amount of latency may change depending on the amount/type of modules enabled. It would be nice to be able to compensate for this.

                                      Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

                                      ustkU 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • ustkU
                                        ustk @Dan Korneff
                                        last edited by

                                        @dustbro I wonder if the procedure is not to report the biggest latency, and then compensate IN the plugin for lower latency configuration by adding the difference...
                                        I reckon I've seen that one day but not 100% sure...

                                        Can't help pressing F5 in the forum...

                                        Dan KorneffD 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                        • Dan KorneffD
                                          Dan Korneff @ustk
                                          last edited by

                                          @ustk said in HISE FX and delay compensation:

                                          report the biggest latency, and then compensate IN the plugin

                                          Not a bad idea!

                                          Dan Korneff - Producer / Mixer / Audio Nerd

                                          1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • lalalandsynthL
                                            lalalandsynth
                                            last edited by

                                            Just to be clear , does the plugin not normally compensate for latency unless I do something specific to make it do that ?

                                            https://lalalandaudio.com/

                                            https://lalalandsynth.com/

                                            https://www.facebook.com/lalalandsynth

                                            https://www.facebook.com/lalalandsynth

                                            Dan KorneffD ustkU 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
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