Pure Data?
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@christoph-hart It is a bit like regex in the fact that it is very powerful what you are able to do with very few characters of code. Its actually quite brilliant, it just takes a bit of getting used to because it is a shorthand textual representation of dataflow networks like pure data or max/msp.. you can split signals with < (think of the less than being like to wires splitting out visually) and then you would have the processes separated by commas.. and to sum together a group of parallel you would use the >.. and the "~" represents feedback for recursive z-1 filters etc.... @10 would get the memory at 10 samples ago.. delay lines etc.. it makes alot of sense if you can happen to find a good tutorial.. I have a bajilion things bookmarked for faust and there are a couple getting started guides in there but you can probably find most of what I looked at from their website and github repo readme
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FYI they have a FAUST JUCE JIT compiler I think, pretty sure Oli Larken has a video about it from the JUCE conference maybe 2016?
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Funny, I watched this yesterday.
The problem is building LLVM and faustlib, but then it it should be pretty straightforward. It will probably only be available on macOS / Linux though as building LLVM on Windows is the Bowser of software development.
The idea is to have the JIT compiler available in HISE for rapid development and it when you export your plugin, the faust compiler will create C++ files that are embedded in the plugin so that the exported plugins have no dependency on Faust (Faust is GPL but the generated code inherites the license of the used libraries, so it plays nicely with commercial projects.
Do you know how polyphonic synthesisers work in Faust? Since HISE is a framework for virtual instruments, it would be pretty stupid if it couldn‘t use Faust for making sound generators.
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@christoph-hart a bit off topic but I've been playing around with csound also, and it's polyphonic by default. Opcodes included in csound are in fact modules that would be great for hise. I mean you can load for example the 'pluck' opcode and it's a fully functional Karplus strong module http://www.csounds.com/manual/html/pluck.html
There are 1500 opcodes LGPL out there -
Very exciting to have the power of Faust DSP connected to a sample engine/ plugin generator/GUI powerhouse! Keep us posted, this is very interesting!
In regard to polyphony, with my experience its very easily implemented inside Faust code using
nvoices, however I don't know the exact way it works inside the compiler. Currently it's similar (in my eyes) to how csound does polyphony. (It "just works
").In regard to including Csound (and this is a cool idea) I feel that especially for physical modelling having access to the DSP code is much more flexible than using an opcode. Mind you currently Faust isn't the best for FFT resynthesis, (hopefully it will get that soon).
I'm not a Windows user, so can't comment on LLVM for that platform, mainly Linux, MacOS. (Addicted to POSIX).
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@christoph-hart I think it would be a very BAD idea to build functionality into HISE that cant resolve to plugins that work across all platforms, sure (as I understand what you are saying) you might have some facility ONLY on the Mac platform that generates the C++ from Faust, but then there needs to be a way to "import" that C++ into HISE on any platform.
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The macOS limitation only applies to having the JIT compiler embedded into HISE as Development Tool. When you compile the plugins, the faust compiler will
generate C++ files that are natively compiled on every platform.So in order to develop DSP in Faust you need a Apple computer but the generate plugins will run everywhere (everything else would indeed be very stupid).
This being said I am trying to get the windows build done too - I am doing the majority of work on windows so it‘s rather selfish ;)
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@christoph-hart Windows can wait :P
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Libre Wave - Freedom respecting instruments and effects
My Patreon - HISE tutorials
YouTube Channel - Public HISE tutorials -
I am afraid everything has to wait until I have time for this :)
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@d-healey what about Commodore 64?
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I‘d prefer Symbian OS so you can run it on 10 year old Nokia smartphones.
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@christoph-hart this was my first DAW Cakewalk for DOS (for real, I'm 42)
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I was on ATARI STE, with Notator. Still one of my most favourite memories. That computer was so lovely for music composition. Even had built in MIDI ports!
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@christoph-hart In Faust polyphony is not handle as the compiler level, but at the "architecture files" level. The compiler will be used to generate a single voice, with a special parameter naming convention to describe the freq, gate, gain controls. then a special mydsp_poly class (coded in faust/dsp/poly-dsp.h) is used to "wrap" the single voice and make it a MIDI ready polyphonic instrument (with voice stealing..etc...). You can read this paper : http://www.grame.fr/ressources/publications/09_C_B_137724.pdf.
Note that the MIDI implementation is no yet full (no multi-timbrality = MIDI channel support), but you can as least test the idea. This model can be used with libfaust/LLVM dynamical compilation chain, of with statically generated C++ DSP. -
@christoph-hart The libfaust/LLM dynamic compilation chain for developing and testing, and static C++ files generation for release is a great idea. Oliver Larkin is using the same model in his iPlug2 framework: http://olilarkin.blogspot.com/2018/06/iplug2-faust-wams-auv3-video.html
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@christoph-hart i just modeled the sound I was looking for with csound :) hope we can include this in some way into Hise soon
https://soundcloud.com/user-830166644/model-fork -
Forget about Csound...
is coming :)
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@christoph-hart what is it??? Where is a tutorial or something. Can't find anything googling it (want to be ready for your release :)
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Well it's a new visual programming environment that I am currently developing. None of the candidates so far perfectly fitted the requirements:
- PD is not embeddable and has a runtime overhead
- Faust is a bit too nerdy :)
- CSound is not embeddable
- Max/MSP is proprietary
Basically it combines the workflow of Max/MSP and PD with the code generation facilities of Faust. You can build your algorithm using a visual programming environment and it spits out C++ code that replicates your algorithm. During development you can use a (rather slow) interpreter, but when you export plugins, it will use the C++ code that should be optimized by modern compilers to a degree of hand-written C++.
There's also a "Javascript" node, which can be used for certain tasks that are better implemented using a text-based approach.
