@dannytaurus said in AI takeover the plugin industry:

@SampleScience You were the person who inspired me to start!

I've used your plugins from way back. I built my first Maize plugin around 2016 but didn't follow up on it.

Then I saw you included in a Gumroad article about creators who had made over $100,000 selling digital products on the platform. That really inspired me to start properly with plugins and now Meat Beats has been my living for 3 years now.

I'm very concerned about the future. I don't think AI is going away.

That's so cool to hear! It made my day!

I'm also very concerned about the future because of the disruption caused by AI pretty much everywhere. It's changing the way people find my business, how they learn about updates and new releases.

On the plus side, I've never had better feedback from my customers and after 10+ years I have a loyal following, but for how long?

That's the question!

Personally, I'm currently moving from software to reviewing hardware under a new brand name. I want to stay in that industry for as long as possible as I don't see myself doing anything else.

@dannytaurus Love your work by the way. You did amazing things with Maize Sampler.

@David-Healey said in AI takeover the plugin industry:

@SampleScience said in AI takeover the plugin industry:

a quality audio plugin

How do you know the quality if you can't read/understand the code?

Because it gives the sound and results users want. And it's also stable; bug fixes can be provided by AI now. I'm the first to be shocked and surprised by this! I didn't see it coming.

Now, what I see is a new phenomenon: YouTubers who create their own plugins and give them away or sell them, effectively bypassing plugin developers in the process.

Worse, if they want to, they can copy a cool plugin concept that they received in their email inbox, clone it using AI, and sell it to their audience without anyone between them and their customer base.

Business-wise, it makes much more sense for them. For developers, it's a new nightmare.

My income is now slashed by 50%, and my traffic is a third of what it used to be. Even if I release a quality freebie, it doesn't mean anything anymore. It has much less impact than it used to.

I've always been skeptical of all the AI hype out there, but now it's different. What I'm seeing and what I've tested shows me that making a quality audio plugin isn't hard anymore. As long as you have the idea, you can make it without any programming/scripting/UI design skills.

I have to be honest, I'm shocked! I knew it was coming, but I thought we had another 10 years or so ahead of us. Now, I think we have 2 years at best.

I've been making a living creating plugins since 2015 and it's been great. Making a living from my passion for sound design, UI design, and tech felt like living the dream. But now the dream is over and I have to wake up.

Even sample-based instruments from acoustic instruments aren't safe anymore. During the last 2 years, I've spent a lot of time learning how to do this and now I don't see the point anymore.

More recently, I thought about increasing my skills by learning HISE scripting inside-out, but seeing that people can just take a screenshot of my plugin's page, paste it into ChatGPT, ask it to create a prompt to clone it in Codex, and get a decent clone in a matter of minutes, I think it's time to call it quits. In a matter of hours, the same plugin can be polished to the point where the user will have a customized plugin for their own needs.

I can't compete with that. It's just impossible. No matter how hard I work on a plugin, if it becomes a success, it will be reverse-engineered.

So what's left? Hope.

Hope that at some point the AI industry will collapse because it's not a viable business model. If that happens, I'm pretty sure everything will go back to how it was and AI plugins will disappear like a bad dream.

I've done a lot of experiments with local LLMs and they are nowhere near the frontier models. Fairly close depending on how you use them, but they break quickly the longer the conversation gets. And the results are inconsistent. Even with a $10,000+ computer setup like the one I have.

The overabundance of new plugin "companies" and the lack of editorial filtering from the media outlets that cover the industry make it much harder to break through and get actual sales.

So here are the questions: has the AI takeover affected your business income? Can you see it in your stats? Or is it business as usual? Are there solutions I'm overlooking? Things that are obvious? Let me know.

@David-Healey Thank you for doing this. It really helps me in my Hise Sampler quest!

@adriano Do you distribute your plugins to your friends online or by using USB keys? Because if it's by using USB keys, you won't have any problems, it's when it's downloaded via the web that the Gatekeeper will interfere with the app/plugin.

@d-healey said in Export tool:

@dustbro That's the plan, on MacOS anyway (does anyone sign apps on Windows?).

AudioThing does it to prevent Windows 10 security message to pop-up. It just looks more professional but it's not necessary.

Amazing! I badly need something like this!!!

@Christoph-Hart said in Catalina has been released...:

Just don‘t care about catalina ;)

People know by now how to bypass the notarization error...

I wish it was the case for my customers, but I got so many emails that I'm really tired of the whole situation now.

It's the zip file that you need to notarized, at least that's what I understood from reading the whole KVR thread. :P

In any case, for the moment I'm out. I'm just fed up by the whole situation and I'll probably go Windows only for my upcoming plugins. This way, I'll do what I like, which is to create plugins. Solving endless problems created by Apple has never been part of the plan for me.

@Lindon said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience plugins (no matter how they are built) dont need to be notorized, just codesigned.

I thought you were right but on KVR I've read this: "When it’s signed it seems to run fine first. But when I upload it and download it again, it will not run anymore. I’ve read somewhere in the documentation that all software needs to be notarized. They specifically mention plugins too." (quote by e-phonic: https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=531663&start=45 ).

So I guess that plugins, in order to work on Catalina, need to be both notarized and signed.

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience Here is the guide for signing and notarization ;) : https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531663

I went through the thread and found that the signing of Maize made plugins doesn't work because: "the code-signing does not longer allow references to other files within the .component file". The way Maize Sampler works is by loading mse files found within the plugin. This means that I'll either have to move completely to Hise or cease to release macOS compatible plugins.

Another problem: I found their signing process slow and cumbersome considering I have close to 50 plugins in my catalog. lol Just thinking about it is painful. lol

@d-healey said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience I have MacOS, Windows 10, and Linux Mint, all installed on my Mac Mini :)

Impressive! :) This is something I should do, it would be much more intelligent than using multiple computers like I'm doing now.

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

You aren't limited for installing only one operating system in each computer. I've installed 4 macOS versions in my mac computer. So when I lunch the computer, I select the one that I want to use.

I didn't know you could do this with macOS, I thought it was only possible with Windows and Linux. Thank you for your answer!

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience no, directly in the Operating system, without virtual box.

So you keep the old version, how do you know your plugins work on the newer versions of macOS?

I'm asking because the vast majority of support requests I get are from macOS users who have compatibility problems. There are never any problems with Windows versions of my plugins, but for the moment I use Maize Sampler.

With Maize Sampler you have to align the version of macOS with a specific version of Maize (use the version of Maize that was out at the same time as the version of macOS), otherwise, you get problems.

I'm trying to switch to Hise but I'm having a different set of problems with it (mostly export and project management issues).

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience

In our plugins, I've just tested down to the Mavericks too. The plugins were signed and installer was notarized in Mojave and they work down to Mavericks.

Also probably, they should work down to a couple of level older versions too.

Do you test using macOS Mavericks on virtualbox?

Does anyone know if plugins made for Catalina (signed) will work with previous versions of macOS? If so, how far in previous versions will it work? I see that Audio Damage supports 10.9 Mavericks or newer and I wonder how they are knowing it for sure.

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

@SampleScience Here is the guide for signing and notarization ;) : https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531663

This looks great, thank you! I guess that the process can be applied to Hise Sampler made plugins too. Hopefully, it is.

@orange said in Catalina has been released...:

For plugins, you only need to sign them digitally with Apple Developer ID ($99/year). Actually, you can't notarize plugins. But if you don't sign the plugins, they won't load in the DAW. (mabe they can work in Catalina first release, but not for the further updates). By the way I don't know if Maize Sampler is digitally signing plugins or not while exporting.

It is now with the new version. How do I sign my Hise Sampler plugins?