Filter ADSR?

Lindon

@d-healey can be done with scriptnode polyphonic fx but the filter does not close all so you can hear some notes still ^^ but this can be fixed somehow maybe another filter type

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..and this I assume is some attempt to get a polyphonic filter ( so each note plays a sound that is then modified by its own filter). Filters dont, classically, work this way - they are applied at the output buss for the sound generator - filters are too expensive to apply on a per note basis - and the routing would be a nightmare.

Straticah

@Lindon yes i wasn't talking about hise but about synths in general from the 70s 80s where one or more filters give the ability to fade into the oscillator.
because there is a difference in sound if i use a filter or a gain knob. i know that the filter does not control the envelope, but it shapes the amplitude over time.

my moog example sound strange maybe does not work in poly

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Straticah

@Lindon exactly, but i dont see any problems in that if its not hardware :) maybe limit the voices to 3 like in hardware synths or something but should be possible to give each played voice an own filter with poly scriptnode right? I was thinking about pitch shifting each played note to give it the drift of old synths. (would be best to do this in midi tho and not with the audio signal but also no idea how to do that since this would be a polyphonic midi effect)

Lindon

@Straticah said in Filter ADSR?:

@Lindon exactly, but i dont see any problems in that if its not hardware :) maybe limit the voices to 3 like in hardware synths or something but should be possible to give each played voice an own filter with poly scriptnode right? I was thinking about pitch shifting each played note to give it the drift of old synths. (would be best to do this in midi tho and not with the audio signal but also no idea how to do that since this would be a polyphonic midi effect)

-- exactly how will you isolate each notes sound? You could decide you wanted to be 8 note polyphonic and have 8 sounds sources(8 samplers or 8 synths) and round robin assign incoming note to these (monophonic) sound sources, and then have a filter in each sound source, but as I'm sure you can see this becomes impractical very very quickly.

Straticah

@Lindon thats true, but in this example i have exactly what i want each voice has its own filter, all notes have the same envelope tho which is okay. next step would be the drift which can appear on each triggered voice, this has to be midi tho so it does not eat cpu.

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Lindon

@Straticah said in Filter ADSR?:
okay deleting all of this because now I can make it work....hmm...nice

hmm. ... but now its leaving that risidual again...

Straticah

@Lindon ye i am getting closer last thing would be the voice drift, will make a thread for that and see, maybe it is custom script with a midi container

HiseSnippet 2075.3oc6Zs7aabbFeVRMzhRJ1Io0ws.EnDH.EJnoBjxtIAHHfqjnnsPMknMUkSOoNd2gjCzt6rY2YkDcPOkCI.8P6gVT3a8XOzC8ZuYfBTfTn.jF+OPBPNDzStGx4jY1GbmguzRZIk5jRAHv442uu2eyLroG0.66S8.ZE2smKFnsDrUOGV2M5hHNfspAztLrAxmg8JE0058bQ99XSflV9aJ5Pq3bfvOOo55HKjiANsK.XOJw.eahMgk1aS8eAwxpNxDuKwVZ12PeKCpyFTKZ.GO4gkAtHiCPcvaiDSKGDnUXSSBi50hgXXef1bqSM60pK8Hmn4uGwmbeKrnQEPK9FE0ccpko.whuC1nKwxrYBe6C.ZvloRg7QRguOrAwjzu+TowyGNPozUHKOzxMI3UYFgmlD7lKBdu.rkgGwkkNh.aKB2xgqnZi3p.YXEMWf1ifaP4SvgshM5.bcOdi9KX4Wqb4WsD+euxa1NvwfQnNknNaSY3cbV9UV3cWn3B+lEJM3PsaOxwDjwiZYg8F4vBst2jV3xNA12G68pkNDYEf6OQN6qJeKjM4qQDWKMQpyVND1Nt331oZfJiPC.hEa7u8K2pFhgDJk393yyE6wHB3nUCeH2ZOREUDVC6e.i5xs2GR+wshnlAVHlpokveJd.t7PQGJTTN9DVOY+smZ6sQxsYDtu.rIgYzcz3M2HvKWpkc7Vdlvar26yA2rcarAKEryAq+1ypq5rAkqFAkEg2CcHNLjZHPtZX61TO6R2D6f8DxzJSHn5Gm0fptYNn5NFLND10C436R8wUj24AFaU4wpgYANxSurdTWJyRvd04rmz7lWOoyUk6rIxQg171J6TCxwoM+zpa5f3JjVXN2XtiuAmYExNY2glAV936QLYcqHuvztWUt6ag7L45ECECz7yjCkpeqz7GQz7BeCjro7Yty+Serp7YSzdJ4CKlfwVDaWK7lNGhs3AjCw3Kxi.2FEXwR5U0OqA0g51k5PTr.tKl4Q5zAqXXMRFZMFiWch5ZsvH+TeuO3w52l3fQdb4D97WVLI80O.FA2RhfCkNmxwT9hMGS9uEkiYJJGL+vxtKCaRs5EUlGGCBvbsvthruKEMRo5uckQVW3OFNpZvjJ6BdFYtJUH01X1QTuCBsgi+NO1XDxc6i788Cg39sOtBXMKK5QaPscIwlBbNHruTFUT3QzLvb0hiC1ZMaZ.mdZPsbbhdKj+tHhkXZ6g87C2jKAKuB+Otcy1gdov5HCNu1qIhmwla.JJdjqgwdqXzWSONHJKbE6VRVWnFHj4ssELe3AYxKU3XjarnE2RNmf.KA2xeOwnFHKvdhhfEXFH1yHIVHTCEWK.M85s+QXFuJ1wgbeWKdoBBMVSjG+rT7Z9EkqlSFiEK7vN+ouRfSYtPEyIzOQTkReWAMOEI2zHcRnTdIN8JIb591ji4AnUH2yGRNtc6JG2lWCj2XoVJeJSwDeNsbCnYxMfl4JvsCrkjhwJmH6Kv.St.LLxe7blGFkM..ZcjHp1tHuNXVHQj6H9vEN3PGRe0lwx9sLSD7cDR193QzegvTypDI66oP7N98ThwEFsIs3dQMHNwroTAbniGnumTsEC61h7.k405.7QQJSkjt0DNmQavPa8ZALpMOZjYe+BE2gPNPw9XQt8gGdkNSxP7TMMxIaZnJLxOYgwu5QCKL3Ltpv3O+vG92qNjv3Qc9aWUOxZJTIbJxBIbTHSJE8emdlvwu96U6wUitlgV1TJqKwoyff4F5mB8OKjCKAuK1GyFikAPJ1zkfntl9CEo.GWO3JQiNEwkfSLp8jiMbl3zeEnEw4.9BefGOIWOUuzEg08vuS.1wn2o39K3Jd4xGmbYF0H7TDndqGvKoIx2VoGA+4XhOVvKeE+yl12GaxcJBWtPvn5KTbpsA+f+Q1rA02twGFZCNeb8rx5e8+8Imrl9z6.L0QkdtXheaL2NJEAewOox7+0ez+oJ37m8K.uEOpDXnc4BfzWhepJCTOYZ+6+jSV5dWDB9hvVA9Lkff2dob+z2+k9vKBgdQXxA7j1naU.T5gWjFcaD3c3Pg8dR0yHD7jpiGAKBSOb7vgcO+ouH+GaTQ7SOdX+nqfYo7Z4fX.kRbEUEcdUhqbwzCFdWgbWC1lXIP2JpSZVO0wfIApGs6oecJC6WXxk.cC8gcAerdlbBzeO6OJ1DLMC2PUwj45fzu90eb0A.yiN4jWNafA7x+2ONDL4g2Yp8CWcD0+rp9zEIXb0Ad9EDZxk98V+k+4G8aeveXVBAAzm1P.xGn5BM5SQXzEPaNBctx4O5eBp++4O9N44Odpy7L1CYeNUYw7vZd8tG+TBCsOY8LIp2KixYRRNAOXrltf0ozCrQg2E3S86qF+d.unzseFmKKxGNpwjdvM.HMESb5hO6f+n9cjkKp2m+x52I.YobMzMzWm3RsPdY5Jpm8q+etLdO5uTZdymkt7egl4YG79CgwJ8RBg8yN39xv67+Vf8RQfcd3FcodA9wttQMTccuq3.AwAsu4m8upF9JuIwq+xk+7p0wXy6q7LceQ0ZXKjJCk+r58MtKMfwSK0.wOmjnr4sCrawSsaj7bD9I2FTb6xIUo2B6XVNoN63AqHZqEOXkjAy9Kz1fb7yNFgWCtiuwpkBetuRey+deWDJxKBZXiL7n6G+zHhLFyG1CmucB+M0UD1PztTEvgwWVo34v.1DSx9FFh2z7mwkOidMqNCq45yvZtwLrle9LrlWaFVyqOCq4Ml3ZD+hOhqnVX+y6n4lQG3VK4.HbWAvWCjHsAuO

lalalandsynth

@Straticah Why do you want to use only a filter envelope and not a regular VCA/Volume envelope too ?

Lindon

@Straticah might be better control like this:

HiseSnippet 1966.3oc6Z0DaabbEdVRMzhR1INowH8VHPt3.jHHJ6llhT.tRhhwBwThwTUV8j53cGRNP6Ny1cmURLA4PSxg.jC4TQgu0q8VOzK4Rh.xkTfT.i5i4PbNkqN2CP5L6Obmg+IRZI0j1HAXn8M+79d++d65F9LKbP.yGXTbmtdXfwkgM6R4cVuChPAaVEX7Tv5n.N1uTLo055gBBv1.Ci7ugjfQw4.Q+73JqgbPTKbFI.XWFwBeahKgmQsg4aRbbpgrw6PbU18MM2zhQWm4vBE3IObYfGx5.Ta7VH41xAAFE1vlvY9M4HNN.XL2ZL6tM6vNhFu+cIAj64fkOTFzTbQwjqwbrkHVRErdGhiciT4N..LfMxzB4i0BOGrNwlzidl13pQKTJ6Dp5Cib5vKuF7JqBukUf2PfjgBjlKFROCrokOwimshDOKB2jJLNsPB0tJTh2Kv3D35LwFn7kbQGfq4Kdn2At9qt7xubIw+7RudqPpEmvnkXzsXb71zq+RK7NKTbg2cgR8uTqVCcMIa7YNNX+gtrzR6OtCdcZn68v9uboCQNg3daTH955T3n0oplbqXoVYiL5lTBeaOLcTNBfDUk3u9caVEwQRCQBMw97v9bhDBFUwGJ7piMKEgUwAGvYdB+5ArYBuElcnChq6BIiaRVPnCzraRiCMfv6pFWcl4WMoP7YfMHbqNCGi4FBFEZpyCLlDMdE3FsZgs3Y.bNXs8NeB8TY+0hY+hv6hNDGkVLh4WK54VLe2RuAlh8k5txiIw3ClzDidSbhwss3BHriOhF3wBvkUu49VaE00ph4gT0sW5jXRZ6RJd0Dhmx9l2Lk3JpDafnZ7V7r1MUmbb1iOpxFTjvHzDKjF6sCrDBqT2o5p2HzI.eWhMuSY0ClQdEUx2B4aKrKVZNh4GWMhxyXMhB+nqFwOAR2nUFqXJFaRb8bvaPOD6HxoFgwmUjDsEJzgmRUObpNix75vnDMC8cvbeR61XM+mgJPqx4hFIzOqCFEjEhs2GZdaBEi7E5I7LpKJO0kzGp85WBigaIYNfROI1s4lL61387OSJYj++oKYLLS6SAavb5F2ElfuR.77Qjh8iKEuRoZ6Udnss8Bvg0hjRWQvyH2Rkdd1ByOh4ePj.k72h7dwH2qGx2OHBh6253xfUcbXGsNy0ijXxERPDsLAU1uP7NvBSAkhcV0kEJ3mAzHmfo2BErCh3H21tX+fnK4RvkWR7qv+XqnnQXMjkPV61.IJ.Kbzj81IrpX+kr5YcGEDUUtxaKsHJz.DI7ttRgOZ1h7J83EaSkOI7XyIYvkgaFrqbUKjCXWYOpRLCj2YrFKBpQpqEf19c2+HLuLXjHOvyQT4WZwZf7Ei2HZIW1YYNULVrv8a+W9AINUkBcLmx+TUUF+8j77TzbSi1IkSyoHoOcpjtuK4XQhXM1c0H1I7aW53VhVZ7GI2xjSUNllVRDnpaYx0mk4ogaE5pnESLNw9Wf91bAXTF9j8LOLNqO.z7HY1qcP9sw7HlnRHYN.JNJfLP+wDc+l1oJ91RMaO7HoWHpDrNSl76TpdG8cpH3Rm1zmDQQ0IzDwToeLzw8Q6wUZxwdMIus19Zd.9nXioVw0pxfy3KXfqd0PNyUjMxtWbgV3PjDn4ernv+vGuT6w4HdptF4TcMzUF4Gux32exfJCgfqqL9q2+9eRkATFmz9ueMyXuoHivonKTvQgIxnX9wlSDN9C+hpOrR7aAnoKiw6Pns6GL2z7T3+Ygd3xv6fCv7Q3Y.TxMcIHpicv.YJvI88sT7pSQdI3XyZO9bCmIA8PnmKRO1LMFY7A7R4PzH7wouogpDQQAT20BEMtDGMqQQJQTa7wRz+Che1v8dXaQXPzwkpBcu+hSsW2G94SlWm4V0+mQdcymzoppE+pE.l6YN8t7Scdnqjv7aiEdNfAtLv4u3W.dKQdnoNd6rf0WRLujEpae79D+KBEeQXyv.tVZu26Ou9G47se0EgRuHLczMkKZ64.+1+zEoS25g9GNPhtGU4LBAOtxnQvhvrwdGLQ64O+kU73CKGe1fe8xmpl2ONKoVV+qzq+P4RyZi5CiwiLScvgszyTuHrlO9OFhoVcmttGt.akZ7F0G+YO4.YAX8PGNwyQIix2+29t+c868fJW.rGBW0VIO5d+l+wWb3m90U.yx7Xp1Pf1LQx1nOulIJmlmtzKqOO8VDGIlVRtzL6o2W+B0huyr+bJ6Pnv38vuo4fYqen4DYYMee2+UR1prvqAZwch8xMuwMdXk9.yIe4W9hSFX.u328fHvjG9VSceBqLjliWwb5buG0PBme0qN04BL+l29ClkpUW0bZqVnNs8EZgphv3O1f8Pr4ZCm1a75ed3z+ub3zm3pLi7MvbN0D57vp9cuqXfxAtmIaf09eocCez0Q55BViwNvEE8hhOm+N40IGW5G0em7mGtcf0Jkh9xGk9uym93NrPtHxpNRLUfrx+VgtMEYmrRec6AousijmWNsQilXp8xosJjrXY4yFIKVNcwKDd3hr7Y6mLQfz4c9HJB4lF8+9mhv5xmKUFbXx6vQ9UB.tDax9VVxOuyqTF.F9YVYFNyMlgybyY3L+pY3Lu5Lble8LblWarmQ9QtSpkH84EDZrQbqlFokdEt+f+C9aSy4.

Straticah

@lalalandsynth i am not that deep into hardware that is outside of eurorack but do oberheim synths or prophets use a volume envelope after the filter envelope?
vca would be a simple gain knob for the signal going into the filter outside of hardware i think

Straticah

@Lindon this one would mix the unfiltered sound with the filtered tho which we dont want or am i missing something? :)

Lindon

@Straticah its just your envelope modulated filter - but passing the envelope signal through a scaling function so you can have the envelope apply (start from) a different freq value...

ulrik

@Straticah I like what you're doing, interesting!
You can also have an envelope per voice as well, at least in the usual Hise (not script node) , I'm not so familiar with script node yet, but I guess you can accomplish that there as well.

lalalandsynth

@Straticah Yes, all synths would have a VCA.

Like this ... also with the capability to have the envelope offset by the cutoff point ( although that is not always the case) and be able to invert the envelope.
I would be interested in non poly behaviour as a lot of early mono synths need that behaviour.

HiseSnippet 2081.3oc6Z0DaabbEdVRMzhR1INs0H4VYat3.jJHJ6FWfdfqjnXrPLkXMUkSOoNZ2gjCztyrc2YkDSQygjbHE4PPNDT3a8VAxI2i8TIPAJPARALpOFfB2Ks.Es.NG6ozY1eHmkbIEICohkgkALz76668+adZq4xLvddLWfV98Z6fAZWFVuMk2ZyVHBErcYf1K.qh73X2BgSsQaGjmG1Dnok8MkSnkeAPvOOozFHKD0.2aJ.XeFw.eGhMg2a1Z5uEwxpBxDuGwVY22TeaCFcSlEyWfmrvUANHiiPMw6fjaKCDnkaKSBm4Vmi3XOf1BavLaWuE6DZ392m3QNzBKGTDTWbQgSWgYYJQrbVvlsHVl0h4aO.PCVqmTHanT36.qRLIcmumz3pAKTn2ITkGZYRBurIfWQU3spB7RARZJPZgPH8Rv5FtDGduUj3YY31TgxoARH1UgR3dAZcfaxDafxWwFcDthqXP2Cb82X0Ue8Bh+609wM7oFbBiVfQ2gww6Ru9qszubo7K8qVpP+K0nQpqIIiKyxB6l5xRMs6nN30o91Ghce8BGir7wc2nf8SJSgCWlppxMB4ZkMxnaSI7ccvzgYH.hDUhe6mtcYDGIUDQyI1mC1kSjPPqL9XgUcnZIOrL16HNyQXWOfNSXsvL8sP7jlPR+lnEDxfD5Moxg5Q3sU8qlY1UiKDeIXMB2nU5XLSJXTHolGXLxa7JvsZz.av6AvEfUd64iqmJ4uVH4WFdOzw3fvhAD+ZAiavbsK7lXJ1UJ6JNh.iObbCL5L1AF20fKfvdtHpmCyCWT8l6as0TWqLl6SU2dgNgSkXWR1qhf8T12h5wStl5j0PzDzVLNwMUkbZugOtzVTjPITGK3Fyc8LDLqT1oZpWy2xCeOhIuUQ0C1a50Tm91HWSgdwHggX1Qkin3TliH2Sc4Ht.DtIQZr7wXrNw1wBuE8XrkHlZ.F+VhfnMP9V73YS5NUkQYNsXTRBE8cwbWRyl3D1OoxPqy4hBIRdVKLxqmK1G9H86PnXjqPNgmRYQwINkdp5qWAFB2BxX.Et3llH6yzoIRSc9BvZLq1gUdInqD.ubvTg1tEBWoPk2tXpkp8cgoUVjRkPvYjonRcN6f4mvbOJfgh9cQrtPj6zE4G3E.wCZbZQv5VVrS1jY6PhT4BNHXtdLprFgvcfEpBJEastMyWPOMnVFAQuMxaODwRts8wtdAWxkfqth3eB6icB7.gUPFBdscMjHoqvPSVOmPqhcWwnq1cXPTU3Jus3DmPMP.yaaKY9f2SjUottPcpbjvhMij.WFts29xUMPVf8k0kJwLPdmgRr.nFHtVBZ519fSv7hfghbOGKQ1doFqFxU7jFQY3xpIynhw74teyeyWIwoJWjDywzOVT0i9NRZdFRtIQ5DSInBm9hwb5A1jSEAeSPtqFPNgc6Jm1PTFi6PoVO9TkhwIg0xzmlISeZlWDtiushTLR4DZeA5ay4fAQ0i1yhvvH8.P8SjQu1C41DyCHh5DQ09SwANjdIGFI621LVv2TJY6hG474BR6ljHi+cJEuC+NUXboQa7HgWTUBMhMUpACcZey8jR04Xm5j2Iw9peD9jPkYhDpkkNmgWv.W859blsHZjYW+hDtCAbPB6ikE1Gt3UZNJCwyzzHipoQRgQ1QKL9YcFTXHX7jBie68u+enz.BiNMev0zCslBTBmgrPAG4FKkh9GqOV33m+sK+nRgu7utMiwaQnM6GL2T+Ln+rPNbY3cwdX9PrL.JwltDD0xzafHE3nZ8VIb0IHtDbjQsGcrgYhSOD5XiR5aF6iLZGdIeHJ98z3tKTlHRJfZugunvkPu4DyH4HpI9TI5+JwOaYeH1T3FDbbonHo0e9I1p6C+SimUm9NU+KAVcKFUcppF+AK.5bn9jaxOwwgtRDwuCVX4.F3x.ye1OG71h3PSr+1rfzWR7FICT69ncG2yCAedXceOdhvdu2mt4GY8u9hyCgddX7y0F3hNGM51z283ABz83RyHD7jRCGAKC68T2ACzN+ouLiGOsX78d3W23opw8WLLtewmgB7mCNkU58LYf+YpE3yC7ewHv++7ge+u3+8t+6uoB724yt0M96+9mG3+o4.+gkGmHp+U51X.4RSaGZRivCsDcuiajLP8xvJt3egOlZzdxd1343anGMPdxe7qOPVBV02hSbrZOXfzyar.gqapFT8y9x+V0C6zOLlhVzopcAIZSlryJyq1jkMgOfz9qOefFDKIlVQtzT6CzWkDUBuyd+5DV6PtQqluo9fwwej9Xol0ee6+ZTbrdNdCz0iwtuI523FOpTefoym+4u53AFvq9kOL.LYg+jItBh0RoeIqoOY15CquQyuLYmYqhz+GuyGLM4wtp9jlGQsArmqovxCC+aNalhNOQ+J61w0Yc+Jy979UdAqekQOxahMDRIx8yU8W.T8esKvXn504zKSVDV1s88v7AioMdcwn++Ddo2HaU9HjpaJraZz.L6YptG828meqa8qW+wkl51vGVQ4.X+UfweYIEPA+snOXawXW97jW9dOvs0m7e+OSOunToNXnwQ.avXGYiB9a3Om+rEqRN8o6uGkWFtqmwZEB9nTJ7MyWkxcY9bQXtpHw61kUfuiuccQxAi3uDBu39QFMd03zF0wTyUiKYOZwhxwZQKVLdwyEZXiLbYGD8lcoU6hAyH3aZvGicdXU43BEAGG0kU4GvAvlXRNvvP9k27CJB.oel0lhybio3L2bJNyObJNyaLEm4VSwY9Qi7Lxu4vnD6RadwD01J7IeZwk.KL+A+ePurhTG

Straticah

@lalalandsynth @Lindon good job this sound pretty good already and gives the character i am looking for, lets see if someone can solve the per voice LFOd pitch tuning

lalalandsynth

@Straticah Why do you have the wet/dry path ?

Straticah

@lalalandsynth thats from the first quick sketch i made to separate the envelope patch from the filtered one, its the dry wet preset in scriptnode, didnt know of a faster way :D

lalalandsynth

@Straticah I see, it makes more sense to me like this.

This is a regular signal path , ending at the vca.

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Straticah

@lalalandsynth isee, is there a way to link both release values to not cut the first envelope?

lalalandsynth

@Straticah On a typical vintage synth there would be 2 typical scenarios.

One envelope - you can select if its for both filter and vca and if you would want the volume to be unaffected you would set the "volume/vca" to gate mode.
Then the "volume" is just on and off and the envelope shapes the filter but not the volume.
2 Envelopes , one for VCA and one for filter , which would give you what you have now.

So to have the second envelope no affect the first one , you would just not use a second one and use the first one for both OR, have a GATE setting where the VCA is on/off and the filter envelope takes care of things ,BUT then when you let go of the key there is no release.

Filter ADSR?

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